Ok so i wanna know if i catch a fish (king) and cut its head off and tail and gut it and make it fit in a cooler would the Fish and Game give a ticket for it because its not a hole fish? even if they know its 24inchs??
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Ok so i wanna know if i catch a fish (king) and cut its head off and tail and gut it and make it fit in a cooler would the Fish and Game give a ticket for it because its not a hole fish? even if they know its 24inchs??
I think you'd be ok, as long as it can be IDed and it measures. I wouldn't see a problem. Then again, I'm not the Law so....
You can interpret however you want but here is the specific code.
"6) All finfish shall be maintained with head and fins
intact through landing. Sharks, swordfish and tuna species may
be landed in the form permitted by the Federal Fisheries
Regulations."
It really depends on the enforcement officer, your attitude towards him, and the mood he is in.
Yeah that's another thing i was worried about is all fish must remain hole.Thats why i dont like to clean fish at the pier because they could bust ya as you walk off the pier or to the truck :angry: i might be able to fold em in half in my 75qt yeti ;D
Just don't keep any fish then you have nothing to worry about. They are full of mercury and oil so why eat them anyway catch and release is the only way to go Just messin around Again all depends on your attitude and the Officer
[quote author=Dick link=topic=1065.msg10245#msg10245 date=1336343076]
It really depends on the enforcement officer, your attitude towards him, and the mood he is in.
[/quote]
yeah anytime i deal with a cop or FWC its yes sir and no sir and you sure you don't want a drink lol Being nice has got me out of a lot of trouble and they told me 1 time since i was so nice about it he gonna give me a warning
[quote author=SandmanFishing link=topic=1065.msg10248#msg10248 date=1336343532]
Just don't keep any fish then you have nothing to worry about
[/quote]
LOL gotta eat mane
How can they enforce it now that they allow yo to throw the fish carcass over in the water now. When i catch a king i instantly go clean it and only keep the filets.
[quote author=Bubba link=topic=1065.msg10255#msg10255 date=1336344673]
How can they enforce it now that they allow yo to throw the fish carcass over in the water now. When i catch a king i instantly go clean it and only keep the filets.
[/quote]
I know i think im gona call the water popos tomorrow and ask and gonna get there name also
[quote author=salt_water_guy link=topic=1065.msg10256#msg10256 date=1336344775]
[quote author=Bubba link=topic=1065.msg10255#msg10255 date=1336344673]
How can they enforce it now that they allow yo to throw the fish carcass over in the water now. When i catch a king i instantly go clean it and only keep the filets.
[/quote]
I know i think im gona call the water popos tomorrow and ask and gonna get there name also
[/quote]
Then you will get into a he said she said fight that will lead to you getting a ticket regardless of what the officer say's
[quote author=SandmanFishing link=topic=1065.msg10257#msg10257 date=1336345203]
[quote author=salt_water_guy link=topic=1065.msg10256#msg10256 date=1336344775]
[quote author=Bubba link=topic=1065.msg10255#msg10255 date=1336344673]
How can they enforce it now that they allow yo to throw the fish carcass over in the water now. When i catch a king i instantly go clean it and only keep the filets.
[/quote]
I know i think im gona call the water popos tomorrow and ask and gonna get there name also
[/quote]
Then you will get into a he said she said fight that will lead to you getting a ticket regardless of what the officer say's
[/quote]
+1
[quote author=SandmanFishing link=topic=1065.msg10257#msg10257 date=1336345203]
[quote author=salt_water_guy link=topic=1065.msg10256#msg10256 date=1336344775]
[quote author=Bubba link=topic=1065.msg10255#msg10255 date=1336344673]
How can they enforce it now that they allow yo to throw the fish carcass over in the water now. When i catch a king i instantly go clean it and only keep the filets.
[/quote]
I know i think im gona call the water popos tomorrow and ask and gonna get there name also
[/quote]
Then you will get into a he said she said fight that will lead to you getting a ticket regardless of what the officer say's
[/quote]
I got idea the new yeti i got has 2 holes on it i'll put a lock on that sucker hahaha
[quote author=salt_water_guy link=topic=1065.msg10261#msg10261 date=1336345508]
[quote author=SandmanFishing link=topic=1065.msg10257#msg10257 date=1336345203]
[quote author=salt_water_guy link=topic=1065.msg10256#msg10256 date=1336344775]
[quote author=Bubba link=topic=1065.msg10255#msg10255 date=1336344673]
How can they enforce it now that they allow yo to throw the fish carcass over in the water now. When i catch a king i instantly go clean it and only keep the filets.
[/quote]
I know i think im gona call the water popos tomorrow and ask and gonna get there name also
[/quote]
Then you will get into a he said she said fight that will lead to you getting a ticket regardless of what the officer say's
[/quote]
I got idea the new yeti i got has 2 holes on it i'll put a lock on that sucker hahaha
[/quote]
Then they might think you are hauling some sort of contraband
Heck Just clean the Fish then plead temporary insanity due to the meds you take for the Heart condition
I think You might be damned if you do damned if you don't It is a chance you gotta take Wish I could be more help Wilson . I Know one Officer will tell you one thing then the next Officer is gonna interpret the Law Completely different
When they gave me a warning for discharging carcasses within 500' of the shoreline, their "reasoning" was due to the IDing of the fish. But like already stated, it all depends on moods and attitudes, not only yours but theirs too. As most are understanding, you still have the ones that are trying to make a name for theirselves.
With smaller kings I cut halfway thru the base of the tail and just pop the backbone and leave that flap of skin "intact" so technically it is in a "whole condition" to check ID and length IF they want to.
A larger fish I would do the same with the head so the torso will still fit diagonally in my cooler.
It would seem the quickest way to get into hot water with 'THE MAN' is to have a fish fillets in your box while you are still fishing. ::)
In that case an angler deserves a ticket IMHO :poke1:
[size=12pt]Probably is best to never mention the pier to the enforcement officers. I have not seen them out there since the carcass decision. Hopefully they aren’t supposed to mess with the tourists fishing on the pier. I wouldn’t raise any questions.
The regulation’s/law’s language is really vague; I have tried asking the exact same questions to different officers and never got the same answer from any two of them.
[/size]
[quote author=Dick link=topic=1065.msg10244#msg10244 date=1336342992]
You can interpret however you want but here is the specific code.
"6) All finfish shall be maintained with head and fins
intact through landing. Sharks, swordfish and tuna species may
be landed in the form permitted by the Federal Fisheries
Regulations."
[/quote]
Is it legal to dehead and gut Bft to save room in the fish bag? That was our plan next trip. With everything that could go wrong, ice and room was our biggest problem.
[quote author=Pier#r link=topic=1065.msg10275#msg10275 date=1336349021]
It would seem the quickest way to get into hot water with 'THE MAN' is to have a fish fillets in your box while you are still fishing. ::)
[/quote]
Just keep the filets in a zip-lock bag with a couple slices of bread and tell them it is your lunch. Problem solved!
Wilson, just give em a mean look.. they will either call for backup, or leave you alone :poke1: :poke1:
[quote author=Peaches link=topic=1065.msg10281#msg10281 date=1336350961]
Wilson, just give em a mean look.. they will either call for backup, or leave you alone :poke1: :poke1:
[/quote]
Or shoot.
[quote author=Pier#r link=topic=1065.msg10275#msg10275 date=1336349021]
With smaller kings I cut halfway thru the base of the tail and just pop the backbone and leave that flap of skin "intact" so technically it is in a "whole condition" to check ID and length IF they want to.
A larger fish I would do the same with the head so the torso will still fit diagonally in my cooler.
It would seem the quickest way to get into hot water with 'THE MAN' is to have a fish fillets in your box while you are still fishing. ::)
In that case an angler deserves a ticket IMHO :poke1:
[/quote]
I deserve a ticket for cleaning a fish and continuing fishing? How about the people that let the king sunbake for hours on the pier? They get a pass cuz the fish is whole, even though it is wasted, and I get a ticket for being responsible?
This looks like another trip to Montgomery to figure out if we really can discard fish carcasses or not.
Throw you UNDER the jail! :poke1: ;) :D
[quote author=Dick link=topic=1065.msg10244#msg10244 date=1336342992]
You can interpret however you want but here is the specific code.
[size=10pt]"6) All finfish shall be maintained with head and fins
intact through landing. Sharks, swordfish and tuna species may
be landed in the form permitted by the Federal Fisheries
Regulations."[/size]
[/quote]
[size=12pt]I thought this language was intended for boats so that fish could be checked at the ramp or dock.
Seems that I remember that the pier is a land bound structure, therefore the pier is considered land.
I also seem to remember a discussion that it is ok to clean your fish on the pier after you have finished fishing. Is fishing defined as having a line in the water, or being on the pier?
Back to square one, it is all a matter of the particular officer’s interpretation of the language.
We may want to leave this alone; in this case the squeaky wheel could get a ticket instead of oil.
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yeah i'm not going to say nothen because i dont want them to come to the pier
With the new rules, cleaning the fish on the pier and discarding remains at and beyond the cleaning station is acceptable because it is more than 500 feet from the shoreline.
That means cleaning fish prior to reaching the cleaning station, and throwing in remains prior is not acceptable.
Now, with these rules into effect, here's how the law will be openly interpreted:
Going to the cleaning station and to the end, you are considered "on the water." Meaning, it would be wise to keep fishes whole while continuing to fish; OR, if you clean them, keep the head, skin and tail in case you need to prove the length. Similar to being on a boat.
Prior to reaching the cleaning station, you are considered "on land" for all intensive purposes, and can follow rules of being on land--which means you could have your fish fillets on hand, but should not be throwing carcasses or parts over the railing.
So, what does this tell us?
Well, to keep from having to rewrite all of the law, recreational fishermen were just given some rules similar to boat fishing in inlets. They basically made a pier an "inter-coastal waterway," if you will.
I would recommend starting your fishing on the end, and catch your kings and spanish. Then, clean them at the cleaning station. Then, if you wish to continue fishing, just stay in the shallows to catch your flounders, whiting, etc., then clean the rest at the cleaning station and leave.
Following that method, you won't be breaking any interpretational rules with intentions being what they are.
Still doesn't mean the officers can't give a citation, but after all we've been through, I am sure Blankenship would politely toss it out if it came down to that.
Seems like there are alot of opinions out there. If I were enforcing the rule it would be that fish should remain identifiable while you are fishing. Where fishing would be defined as having a line in the water and "identifiable" as being able to determine without a doubt the species and that the length meets the minimum. Very simple and fair.
If you fillet a fish then go back to fishing the enforcement officer could see it from the other point of view, "oh he caught an undersized fish and thinks if he cleans it I won't be able to do anything about it." When it comes to the interpretation of a rule always put yourself in the enforcement officers shoes and think about the reasoning a rule was established. If you think something might possibly have a chance of being sneaky or suspicious in an enforcement officers eyes then DON'T DO IT.
[quote author=Dick link=topic=1065.msg10320#msg10320 date=1336394292]
Seems like there are alot of opinions out there. If I were enforcing the rule it would be that fish should remain identifiable while you are fishing. Where fishing would be defined as having a line in the water and "identifiable" as being able to determine without a doubt the species and that the length meets the minimum. Very simple and fair.
If you fillet a fish then go back to fishing the enforcement officer could see it from the other point of view, "oh he caught an undersized fish and thinks if he cleans it I won't be able to do anything about it." When it comes to the interpretation of a rule always put yourself in the enforcement officers shoes and think about the reasoning a rule was established. If you think something might possibly have a chance of being sneaky or suspicious in an enforcement officers eyes then DON'T DO IT.
[/quote]
Bingo.
I can speak from the tourist perspective on this one. As some one who is travelling to the pier to fish, I can tell you that most tourists do not have room for a pier cart or do not want to spend extra money to buy one just for a week of pier fishing.
For the past few months, I have not had room for a pier cart, only room for a cooler. But, I do not have room for a large cooler. Also, since I dont have a pier cart, I cant fill it with ice, since I have to carry it down the pier by hand.
I only put one bag of ice in it, and it is big enough for most fish whole, but not King. If I put a king in there, the ice is insufficient to cool the whole fish. As a tourist I have to make a choice. Kill the fish and throw him off on the side of the road somewhere after a long bake in the sun. Or, clean the fish and keep the filets on ice.
So with the pier being a big tourist draw, how does the State handle that? Fine the tourists because they dont have money or room for a pier cart or large cooler?
Basically it's going to come down to the Officers decision. In my opinion though our practice of cleaning a king then going back to fishing will earn us a citation. The only way I see it being avoided is picture and or video of the legal measure pre cleaning.
[quote author=Bubba link=topic=1065.msg10328#msg10328 date=1336396243]
...So with the pier being a big tourist draw, how does the State handle that?
Fine the tourists because they dont have money or room for a pier cart or large cooler?
[/quote]
Yes! That puts more money into the local and state economies ;-) :yippee:
I like the way you think Bubba! :banana:
That's the gubments way of squeezing every dime from the tourists :3some: